http://www.k-3d.org/forums/tags/python Seven Degrees of Freedom en-US Fri, 10 Feb 2012 12:03:21 +0000 http://bbpress.org/?v=1.0.2 q http://www.k-3d.org/forums/search.php http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/viewmatrixmatrixview#post-4633 Thu, 21 Oct 2010 19:16:40 +0000 djsnickles 4633@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Thanks! So, should I use a MaxtrixView rather than a FrozenMesh, if I wanted to create a "fixed camera", i.e.: the user can not change its position nor target? </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/k3dpropertycreate-for-user-property-list#post-4627 Thu, 21 Oct 2010 18:47:11 +0000 djsnickles 4627@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Thanks for the explanation. I had assumed the UI combo box would just be a simple set of key/values, such as a Python dictionary.</p> <p>In order to simulate this functionality, do you think it would be possible to create the widget from a k3d script with something like PyGTK? Would PyGTK called from a script be able to modify K-3D's UI elements? </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/k3dpropertycreate-for-user-property-list#post-4579 Mon, 18 Oct 2010 21:16:11 +0000 Timothy Shead 4579@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>This one is a fairly fundamental limitation in the way properties work. Currently, there are two types of properties, "user defined" and "plugin defined". Plugin-defined properties can implement arbitrarily-complex behavior in C++, and are easy to serialize, because the only thing that needs to be serialized is their value. User-defined properties (the kind that can be instantiated through Python) can't implement arbitrary behavior (like an enumeration, which shows-up as a combo box in the UI), because there's currently no way to serialize all the possible permutations. So they're limited to a fixed set of types (scalars, colors, strings, etc) and the simplest possible behavior.</p> <p>Cheers,<br /> Tim </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/viewmatrixmatrixview#post-4573 Mon, 18 Oct 2010 21:09:50 +0000 Timothy Shead 4573@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Sorry for the confusion, there was a round of plugin name changes for 0.8 so our terminology is consistent ... "MatrixView" is the correct name, "ViewMatrix" was the old name.</p> <p>You can use MatrixView to produce what some toolkits refer to as a "look" matrix - one that orients an object based on a "look" vector and an "up" vector.</p> <p>Cheers,<br /> Tim </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/k3dpropertycreate-for-user-property-list#post-4555 Mon, 18 Oct 2010 18:12:08 +0000 djsnickles 4555@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Thanks for replying. Drop down lists in the GUI would be very helpful for creating parametric objects, as a user could choose an option/preset, triggering lots of cool possibilities (as seen with the Camera).</p> <p>What would be required to add this functionality? </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/viewmatrixmatrixview#post-4549 Mon, 18 Oct 2010 18:05:59 +0000 djsnickles 4549@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>In the K-3D 0.8.0.1 release on OS X, the following code returns a <code>NoneType</code> for <code>camera_view</code> and gives this error:<br /> <code>ERROR: No plugin factory named: ViewMatrix</code></p> <p>Script:<br /> ——<br /> <pre><code>#python import k3d doc = context.document camera_view = k3d.plugin.create(&quot;ViewMatrix&quot;, doc)</code></pre> <p>——<br /> What's the difference between:<br /> <a href="http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/MatrixView" rel="nofollow">http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/MatrixView</a><br /> and<br /> <a href="http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/ViewMatrix" rel="nofollow">http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/ViewMatrix</a><br /> ?</p> <p>The code above works with MatrixView, however. How are these plugins commonly used? </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/k3dpropertycreate-for-user-property-list#post-4525 Sun, 17 Oct 2010 07:50:18 +0000 Timothy Shead 4525@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>The closest you can get is to create a property of type "k3d::string_t", but there is no way to specify the enumerated values from Python.</p> <p>Cheers,<br /> Tim </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/k3dpropertycreate-for-user-property-list#post-4519 Wed, 13 Oct 2010 22:32:03 +0000 djsnickles 4519@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>What is the correct python syntax for creating a drop-down list in a node, such as the Camera's choices for Aspect Ratio? </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/running-examples-from-wiki#post-4483 Thu, 07 Oct 2010 23:02:18 +0000 Timothy Shead 4483@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Yes, I just committed a fix for this, see my response to your other post.</p> <p>Cheers,<br /> Tim </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/running-examples-from-wiki#post-4465 Thu, 07 Oct 2010 22:51:16 +0000 djsnickles 4465@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p><a href="http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Scripting#.22Action.22_Scripts">This example from the wiki</a> fails on its first line, in K-3D's Python shell:</p> <pre><code>&gt;&gt;&gt; cone = k3d.plugin.create(&quot;QuadricCone&quot;, context.document) Traceback (most recent call last): File &quot;&lt;console&gt;&quot;, line 1, in &lt;module&gt; IndexError: unknown key</code></pre> <p>What is the proper <code>context</code> for creating plugins in K-3D's Python shell? </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/creating-parametric-objects-with-python#post-4435 Mon, 04 Oct 2010 20:35:54 +0000 Timothy Shead 4435@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>K-3D provides a broad set of common geometric primitives, see</p> <p> <a href="http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Geometric_Primitive_Design" rel="nofollow">http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Geometric_Primitive_Design</a></p> <p>for the complete list. Then there are visualization pipeline sources that create instances of those primitives. See</p> <p> <a href="http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Visualization_Pipeline" rel="nofollow">http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Visualization_Pipeline</a></p> <p>for the details. Finally, because we support programmable sources, it's possible to define your own primitive types at runtime. See the whitepaper at</p> <p> <a href="http://developer.k-3d.org/documentation" rel="nofollow">http://developer.k-3d.org/documentation</a></p> <p>Depending on your specific use-case, any or all of these options might come into play for you.</p> <p>Cheers,<br /> Tim </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/creating-parametric-objects-with-python#post-4411 Sun, 03 Oct 2010 22:07:40 +0000 djsnickles 4411@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Let me ask a different way. As I understand, from browsing the docs:</p> <ul> <li> <a href="http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/QuadricCylinder">QuadricCylinder</a> is a 3D parametric plugin, correct?</p> </li> <li> <a>According to the docs</a>, it is possible to create plugins using python scripts, yes?</p> </li> <li> Is it possible to create a plugin just like <em>QuadricCylinder</em> using a python script? If so, is there an example/tutorial?</p> </li> </ul> <p>I looked at the code inside "create_polyhedron.py", but it doesn't show how to program or display user configurable options, such as Radius, Sweep Angle, etc.</p> <p>EDIT:<br /> Sorry, I didn't see your post before replying. Thanks for the link! Something like Sketchup's "Dynamic Components" is exactly what I had in mind. So to be clear, this is currently possible with K-3D? </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/creating-parametric-objects-with-python#post-4405 Sun, 03 Oct 2010 21:50:40 +0000 dsmatthews 4405@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>I fixed the wiki link.<br /> Yes the epydoc shows that the API is all script-able with python.</p> <p>What you are wanting to do is something I have been interested in for a long time and if you look in my to-do list I was looking at even having a python based spreadsheet for the parameters <a href="http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/User:Dsmatthews" rel="nofollow">http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/User:Dsmatthews</a></p> <p>As things stand Tim has been doing a lot of GUI changes that may be relevant to you and I am no longer up to date with the status of what is a feature and what is a still request so I'll have to defer to Tim for any of the details regarding the do-ability of scripted metaobjects. </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/creating-parametric-objects-with-python#post-4399 Sun, 03 Oct 2010 19:37:15 +0000 djsnickles 4399@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Hi dsmatthews,</p> <p>Thanks for replying. I'm imagining a 3d object, which could be placed in the viewport like the QuadricCylinder. It would have its own logic &amp; attributes, all written in python as an plugin (correct terminology?) to a K-3D document. I'm reading the wiki sections on python scripting &amp; plugins, and it seems possible, but I'd like confirmation.<br /> Thanks!</p> <p>PS: would this link help? I get a 404:<br /> <a href="http://www.k-3d.com/docs/epydoc" rel="nofollow">http://www.k-3d.com/docs/epydoc</a></p> <p>EDIT:<br /> Got it, that should be ".org". This wiki link is wrong:<br /> <a href="http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Python#Documentation" rel="nofollow">http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Python#Documentation</a> </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/creating-parametric-objects-with-python#post-4393 Sun, 03 Oct 2010 19:15:21 +0000 dsmatthews 4393@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Like this? <a href="http://k-3d.org/wiki/Visualization_Pipeline_Display" rel="nofollow">http://k-3d.org/wiki/Visualization_Pipeline_Display</a></p> <p>and this, <a href="http://k-3d.org/wiki/File:MetaObject_user_properties-1.png" rel="nofollow">http://k-3d.org/wiki/File:MetaObject_user_properties-1.png</a> </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/creating-parametric-objects-with-python#post-4387 Sun, 03 Oct 2010 13:53:51 +0000 djsnickles 4387@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>I'm looking to create somewhat complicated parametric "building blocks" of construction objects. Blender was somewhat limited in this regard, and K-3D was recommended. After looking through the wiki information and playing around with the OS X install, I'm quite impressed with K-3D, but I'd like to know the community's thoughts on what I'm trying to achieve.</p> <p>I want to:<br /> - create parametric objects using python, which could be loaded into K-3D, just like other 3D objects<br /> - these objects will have gui 'toggles' to control python functions/settings<br /> - objects should be 'locked down': allowing only certain translations/rotations, etc.<br /> - be able to group these objects into super-objects, which would have their own logic/settings<br /> - connect via python to an external data source (socket, db, etc.) for default settings/other data<br /> - use python to manipulate and export raw quantities as csv</p> <p>Specifically, I will start off with light gauge steel profiles as building components, which the user would be able to move, rotate, and stretch on only one axis, as well as toggle various settings per object.</p> <p>Is this possible with K-3D? Thanks for your help! </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/could-not-determine-scripting-language-ubuntu-karmic-k-3d-mercurial-latest#post-3427 Tue, 06 Apr 2010 07:53:58 +0000 Timothy Shead 3427@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Bart is the CGAL guy, I believe he has a patch for the CGAL sources to make things work. FWIW, he's also looking at CURVE, which seems like a better long-term solution than CGAL.</p> <p>Cheers,<br /> Tim </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/could-not-determine-scripting-language-ubuntu-karmic-k-3d-mercurial-latest#post-3421 Mon, 05 Apr 2010 01:33:58 +0000 m@b 3421@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>I have succeeded in compiling though I had to disable both cgal and testing. But scripting is working now which is great. </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/could-not-determine-scripting-language-ubuntu-karmic-k-3d-mercurial-latest#post-3415 Sun, 04 Apr 2010 21:56:50 +0000 m@b 3415@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Cool thanks Tim.</p> <p>I have installed libboost1.40-all-dev because I was using libboost 1.38. There are a lot of dependency changes one of which was libboost-python1.40, this may have been the problem??</p> <p>I also had to remove libcgal-dev because it depended on liboost 1.38<br /> What version of cgal are you using?</p> <p>"""<br /> Which example is failing?<br /> """</p> <p>All examples failed. I am recompiling now and will post my results.</p> <p>Thanks. </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/could-not-determine-scripting-language-ubuntu-karmic-k-3d-mercurial-latest#post-3409 Sun, 04 Apr 2010 21:12:45 +0000 Timothy Shead 3409@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>As an aside, I do most of my development on Ubuntu 9.10, so we should be able to figure-out the problem easily. Which example is failing?</p> <p>As far as the compile-error goes, it sounds like some recent changes may have introduced a dependency on newer versions of boost - in particular, you might want to install the "libboost1.40-all-dev" package, which is what works for me - you may have the older Boost 1.38 packages, which I believe are more widely installed.</p> <p>Cheers,<br /> Tim </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/could-not-determine-scripting-language-ubuntu-karmic-k-3d-mercurial-latest#post-3403 Sun, 04 Apr 2010 20:06:27 +0000 m@b 3403@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Hi all!</p> <p>I have cloned the mercurial source on the latest and compiled under karmic.</p> <p>When I try to run a python script(from the examples) I get the "Could not determine scripting language" error.<br /> I have python 2.4 - 2.6 installed with dev packages of course.</p> <p>I have tried rebuilding with testing enabled so I can see what it tells me, but I get a build error </p> <p>"""<br /> /usr/include/boost/accumulators/statistics_fwd.hpp:87: error: ‘template&lt;int N&gt; struct boost::accumulators::tag::moment’ is not a function,<br /> /usr/include/boost/accumulators/statistics/moment.hpp:104: error: conflict with ‘template&lt;int T2, class Arg1&gt; typename boost::accumulators::detail::extractor_result&lt;Arg1, boost::accumulators::tag::moment&lt;T2&gt; &gt;::type boost::accumulators::extract::moment(const Arg1&amp;)’<br /> /usr/include/boost/accumulators/statistics/variance.hpp:54: error: in call to ‘moment’<br /> """</p> <p>Thanks. </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/yafray-xml-and-python-scripting#post-2753 Thu, 03 Dec 2009 20:48:51 +0000 dsmatthews 2753@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>You may also wish to take a look at this, <a href="http://freestyle.sourceforge.net/index.php" rel="nofollow">http://freestyle.sourceforge.net/index.php</a> </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/yafray-xml-and-python-scripting#post-2751 Thu, 03 Dec 2009 18:29:05 +0000 Timothy Shead 2751@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>You can see the command that gets executed in your console - we run the yafray executable, followed by the path to the world.xml file.</p> <p>Your sample script works fine here, I suspect you might have forgotten to set its execute flag.</p> <p>It does sound as if RenderEngineScript is what you really want, since a render script has access to the full K-3D scene, which is much richer than the contents of a Yafray XML file.</p> <p>Cheers,<br /> Tim </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/yafray-xml-and-python-scripting#post-2749 Thu, 03 Dec 2009 09:48:05 +0000 whale 2749@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>"""<br /> So I've added a new property to YafrayEngine, "Executable", that defaults to yafray, but can be changed to anything that suits you. So you could use that to redirect rendering wherever you like. You'll have to build from the latest sources to get this change.<br /> """<br /> Thanks for that Timothy </p> <p>could you tell me exactly what information is being sent to the binary so i know what to expect, does it send the full yafray xml, or the the direct location to the one created in /tmp?<br /> I made a small python script to check, but it failed</p> <p>"""<br /> #!/usr/bin/python<br /> import sys<br /> test = open('/home/radical/test.log','w')<br /> for arg in sys.argv:<br /> test.write(arg+"\n")<br /> test.write("done")<br /> test.close()<br /> """</p> <p>im trying to make a small toon renderer that will render out the frames with cairo <a href="http://www.cairographics.org/samples/" rel="nofollow">http://www.cairographics.org/samples/</a> i need to somehow get my hands on the coords of each object in each frame. any help is welcome, thanks in advance </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/yafray-xml-and-python-scripting#post-2747 Thu, 03 Dec 2009 08:50:54 +0000 whale 2747@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>i managed to get it to build but it wont start</p> <p>"""<br /> radical@radical-desktop:/opt/k3d/bin$ ls<br /> k3d k3d-renderframe k3d-renderjob k3d-sl2xml k3d-uuidgen<br /> radical@radical-desktop:/opt/k3d/bin$ ./k3d<br /> ./k3d: error while loading shared libraries: libk3dsdk-half.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory<br /> radical@radical-desktop:/opt/k3d/bin$<br /> """<br /> any ideas??</p> <p>EDIT: i just ran it from the build directory and it worked perfectly :). any advice for working with the RenderEngineScript plugin? </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/yafray-xml-and-python-scripting#post-2745 Thu, 03 Dec 2009 08:16:28 +0000 whale 2745@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>thanks, i tried that and it compiled up to 59% then it failed</p> <p>"""<br /> Scanning dependencies of target k3d-ngui-snap-tool<br /> [ 59%] Building CXX object modules/ngui_snap_tool/CMakeFiles/k3d-ngui-snap-tool.dir/snap_tool_detail.cpp.o<br /> [ 59%] Building CXX object modules/ngui_snap_tool/CMakeFiles/k3d-ngui-snap-tool.dir/tool.cpp.o<br /> /home/radical/resources/projects/k3d/modules/ngui_snap_tool/tool.cpp: In function ‘std::_Ios_Fmtflags&amp; std::operator&amp;=(std::_Ios_Fmtflags&amp;, std::_Ios_Fmtflags)’:<br /> /home/radical/resources/projects/k3d/modules/ngui_snap_tool/tool.cpp:1006: internal compiler error: in get_expr_operands, at tree-ssa-operands.c:2072<br /> Please submit a full bug report,<br /> with preprocessed source if appropriate.<br /> See &lt;file:///usr/share/doc/gcc-4.4/README.Bugs&gt; for instructions.<br /> make[2]: *** [modules/ngui_snap_tool/CMakeFiles/k3d-ngui-snap-tool.dir/tool.cpp.o] Error 1<br /> make[1]: *** [modules/ngui_snap_tool/CMakeFiles/k3d-ngui-snap-tool.dir/all] Error 2<br /> make: *** [all] Error 2<br /> """</p> <p>if someone has already compiled this app why cant they just give me the binary?</p> <p>radical@radical-desktop:~/resources/projects/build$ uname -a<br /> Linux radical-desktop 2.6.31-15-generic #50-Ubuntu SMP Tue Nov 10 14:54:29 UTC 2009 i686 GNU/Linux </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/yafray-xml-and-python-scripting#post-2743 Wed, 02 Dec 2009 13:14:18 +0000 dsmatthews 2743@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>Assuming you have installed mecurial and that you use a directory called projects for your builds:</p> <p>cd projects<br /> hg clone <a href="http://k3d.hg.sf.net/hgweb/k3d/k3d" rel="nofollow">http://k3d.hg.sf.net/hgweb/k3d/k3d</a><br /> mkdir k3d-build<br /> cd k3d-build<br /> ccmake ../k3d<br /> # press c until you get the option to press g, it will then exit when finished<br /> # note any missed dependencies and re run ccmake after you have added them.</p> <p># on a 4 core CPU I then build with all cores like this.<br /> # NB -j5 is one more than the number of cores you wish to use.</p> <p>make -j5</p> <p># then if in ccmake you enabled testing you can then run the tests with,</p> <p>ctest -D Experimental</p> <p># to run the application without installing it just,</p> <p>make run </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/yafray-xml-and-python-scripting#post-2741 Wed, 02 Dec 2009 07:57:12 +0000 whale 2741@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>can you explain step by step how i can get it and build it, ive never used mecurial before </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/yafray-xml-and-python-scripting#post-2739 Wed, 02 Dec 2009 07:24:31 +0000 Timothy Shead 2739@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>No, you need the latest sources from Mercurial:</p> <p><a href="http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Code" rel="nofollow">http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Code</a></p> <p>Cheers,<br /> Tim </p> http://www.k-3d.org/forums/topic/yafray-xml-and-python-scripting#post-2737 Wed, 02 Dec 2009 02:09:35 +0000 whale 2737@http://www.k-3d.org/forums/ <p>i thoroughly scraped the wiki for all info i could get before posting, i read about the RenderEngingeScript and it seemed like it did what i wanted (gave the output of the scene for rendering) but 0.7.10 and 0.7.11 configured perfectly but failed to build under latestbuntu karmic koala outputting something about end of file not being declared. </p> <p>i could always hack around the problem by retrieving the world.xml files from /tmp but i would prefer to be able to script a more intergrated solution.</p> <p>the error is posted below:</p> <p>"""<br /> [ 0%] Built target k3dsdk-parallel<br /> [ 0%] Built target k3dsdk-sgi-tesselator<br /> [ 0%] Built target k3dsdk-glew<br /> [ 0%] Built target toFloat<br /> [ 0%] Built target eLut<br /> [ 1%] Built target k3dsdk-half<br /> [ 1%] Building CXX object k3dsdk/CMakeFiles/k3dsdk.dir/gzstream.o<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp:71: error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp: In member function ‘virtual int k3d::filesystem::gzstreambuf::underflow()’:<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp:114: error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp:123: error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp: In member function ‘int k3d::filesystem::gzstreambuf::flush_buffer()’:<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp:139: error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp: In member function ‘virtual int k3d::filesystem::gzstreambuf::overflow(int)’:<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp:146: error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp:147: error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp:151: error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp: In member function ‘virtual int k3d::filesystem::gzstreambuf::sync()’:<br /> /home/radical/resources/stuff/k3d-source-0.7.10.0/k3dsdk/gzstream.cpp:161: error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope<br /> make[2]: *** [k3dsdk/CMakeFiles/k3dsdk.dir/gzstream.o] Error 1<br /> make[1]: *** [k3dsdk/CMakeFiles/k3dsdk.dir/all] Error 2<br /> make: *** [all] Error 2</p> <p>""" </p>